Professional Football Researchers Association Forum

Really bad loss for the Broncos today. You have to now wonder if this isn't the beginning of the end for John Fox in Denver. It just seems that whatever he's done to improve them in his tenure there has been undone by his various failures, and it may just be time for the organization to move on.

Also, Manning had a terrible game, especially by his standards. What is with the guy and the playoffs? Any theories as to why the postseason has been a recurring problem for him?

It's funny watching the different shows tonight and hearing about Manning's playoff record 13 losses. Besides the obvious that football is a team sport, they do realize that you can only lose in the playoffs if you're IN the playoffs, right? As if his post-season 'legacy' (ugh) would be better had his teams went 6-10 ten more times so then 'his' playoff record could be 11-3! Then he'd be a winner . . .

I get that he's hasn't played up to his standard in some playoff games, but he was the QB of a Super Bowl Champion and has played in 3 Super Bowls which his teams would not have been in had he not been their QB - just like the teams wouldn't have been in the playoffs the majority (or all) of the years if he wasn't the QB.

Manning is clearly hurt, as is almost everyone come January, but when you're 38, it takes more than a bye week to get better. I don't think he had any worse of a game than his games in the last month or so. Aqib Taliban, on the other hand, it looked like he was throwing the party on every second play. He was more out of position than I've ever seen, there were plays where it's hard to understand who he thought he was covering.

I think that Fox, Del Rio, and the special teams coach have to go. I have been saying that for months. It's not just an emotional statement.

Here is some perspective about Fox: Someone called 104.3 The Fan in Denver and asked if another coach had gotten a job after a 2-14 season (Fox's record at Carolina in 2010). That says it all.

As for Manning, if Elway thinks that he can't do it anymore, John has to show him the door. However, that's up to John. I think that Manning is done, but I am not 100% sure.

7DnBrnc53 wrote:As for Manning, if Elway thinks that he can't do it anymore, John has to show him the door. However, that's up to John. I think that Manning is done, but I am not 100% sure.

Of course, that leaves them with Brock Osweiler. If he can't step in (he's seen minimal action in three years), Denver is screwed. He also is battling history here: at 6-8, is he too tall to make it considering no one (I think) 6-6 or higher has ever thrived in the NFL?

7DnBrnc53 wrote: Here is some perspective about Fox: Someone called 104.3 The Fan in Denver and asked if another coach had gotten a job after a 2-14 season (Fox's record at Carolina in 2010). That says it all.

Well, it says that the caller isn't from Detroit.

Other than Caldwell, Mike McCormack got hired by the Seahawks after going 2-14 with the Colts in 1981. Phil Handler went 1-9 with the Cardinals in 1945, and got hired back by them a few years later. Sid Gillman was 2-12 with the 1959 Rams, but he made out okay when he went across town the next year. Honourable mention goes to Ray Rhodes and Sam Wyche, who both got hired after finishing with 3-13 seasons with the Eagles and Bengals, respectively.

The Broncos are looking for a new coach now.

On the other hand, how many coaches have been let go after going 12-4 and winning 72% of their games over a 4-year period?

Its really starting to look like a wholesale housecleaning. Maybe Elway is trying to nudge Peyton to the door without having to show him there himself. Del Rio in play for the Raiders, Gase interviewing everywhere. Would Manning want to come back to play for an all new staff with a rapidly aging Wes Welker, with both of the Thomas's potential free agent losses?

rhickok1109 wrote:On the other hand, how many coaches have been let go after going 12-4 and winning 72% of their games over a 4-year period?

Chuck Knox was told to go elsewhere after winning 77% of his games over five years (1973-77) with the Los Angeles Rams. The main reason was never reaching the Super Bowl. He lost three straight NFC Championship games (1974-76).