Who is the most successful weak armed QB?

[MarbleEye]

Was listening to the broadcast teams during the games this weekend talking about throwing the deep ball, and I got to wondering. Who is thought to have been the most successful QB in the NFL, past or present, that had a pronounced weak arm. This should be someone that had at least some measure of success in the league.

A couple of guys sprang to mind for me, Virgil Carter (1968 Bears a nice string of wins, 1970 Bengals AFC Central Champs, 1971 led AFC in completion percentage, 1974 big year for the Chicago Fire of the WFL before injury pretty much finished his career) for whom the "West Coast Offense" was purportedly designed specifically for originally and Scott Hunter, who led the Green Bay Packers to the 1972 Central Division crown with a 10-4 record despite some rather non spectacular passing numbers.

This is a board with a lot of football knowledge on it and I thought I'd see what the men here think about this.

Not looking for a guy like Terry Baker, about whom Harland Svare (LA Rams HC at the time) supposedly said, OK he looks good warming up, now have him put some mustard on it and lets see him throw deep. Assistant coach trots off with Svare's instructions only to returm a minute later to say "He was already warmed up and is now throwing as hard and deep as he can!" Svare was said to have looked totally shocked, thinking that he drafted him #1.

Don't know if that's an apocryphal story or not, but Baker, a fine player and Heisman Trophy winner at Oregon State never did much of anything in the NFL as a QB because he just couldn't throw well or deep enough. I'm looking for someone who was thought to have a decidedly weak arm but nonetheless managed to have at least some success to point at in the NFL.

[conace21]

I would have to say Steve Walsh, who took the Bears and Saints to the playoffs. He lost his job to Erik Kramer in 1995, who proceeded to have a fantastic season, and the time off seemed to hurt his arm rather than help it. He never threw another TD pass in three games as a Rams starter and three years as a backup. He always seemed to throw an interception when he came in to mop up, even if he only threw a half dozen passes.

[King Kong]

Chad Pennington was considered to have a weak arm but he was once the #2 finisher in an MVP race. That was the year after the Jets got rid of him. That was the same year Brett Favre played for the Jets. Favre was an MVP candidate the year before and the year after playing for the Jets but was not good with the Jets. It is enjoyable to be a Jets fan.

[Evan]

Mike Phipps had a career record of 38-31-2 as a starter, and never struck me as having a particularly strong arm.

To me, the answer to this question is Fran Tarkenton. I remember reading Tarkenton said that in his prime he could throw the ball about 59 yards in the air. He retired having won more games as a starting QB than any other QB in history.

Late in his career, from 1974 on, the results of injuries and various injections (see the MMQB interview with him this week - http://mmqb.si.com/2014/12/05/nfl-fran- ... n-iii-rg3/) limited him to throwing the ball about 10 yards in practice, and about 40 yards on game day, mostly due to adrenaline. If Chuck Foreman, Ed Marinaro and Rickey Young hadn't come along to catch all those dumpoff passes, I don't know what he would have done.

The film I've seen on Tarkenton late in his career showed him to often overthrow on long passes (the 1975 Playoff against Dallas in particular), and I wonder if he kind of over-adrenalized when he saw Gilliam running open, and overthrew him, not having been able to actually practice the timing of any long passes during the week. Also I wonder if with an overthrown long pass he wanted to send a message of sorts to the defense that his arm wasn't dead, just so they would have to defend the deep pass and not just crowd the intermediate zones.

[Bryan]

I think a current guy who can be termed as having "success" is Kyle Orton. He's not really anyone's first choice to start, but he usually winds up getting a lot of playing time and doing well enough to continue being an NFL QB.

It seemed like in the 1960's and 1970's an NFL team would periodically acquire an old CFL QB, who would always be short, weak-armed, and smart. Guys like Pete Liske and Sam Etcheverry had a level of success in the NFL, usually being the best QB option on a poor team. I don't think it happens much anymore...perhaps Dieter Brock ruined it for everyone else.

[oldecapecod11]

King Kong » Tue Dec 09, 2014 3:47 am
"...It is enjoyable to be a Jets fan."

Yeah! ... about as enjoyable as it is to be a Giants fan.
I can no longer use the self-checkout because they don't have paper bags there.
If it doesn't rain, I can get three days out of a bag.

Although they had many accomplishments, neither Montana nor Starr nor Tarkenton had particullarly "strong" arms - certainly not in the Bradshaw category.
Another pair might be Conerly and Layne who more than made up for it with generalship and toughness.
One of the strongest throws I ever saw was during practice week prior to the Super Bowl. Bobby Bell threw the ball
over 80 yards (for the camera, of course.)

[JKelly]

If a QB is successful what difference does it make?

[oldecapecod11]

JKelly » Tue Dec 09, 2014 12:28 pm
"If a QB is successful what difference does it make?"

So true!!
It's like wondering how many guys had a greater vertical leap than Wilt but never led the league in rebounding.
Or, how many guys could throw harder than Sandy but never won the Cy.

[BD Sullivan]

To me, the answer to this question is Fran Tarkenton. I remember reading Tarkenton said that in his prime he could throw the ball about 59 yards in the air. He retired having won more games as a starting QB than any other QB in history.

Late in his career, from 1974 on, the results of injuries and various injections (see the MMQB interview with him this week - http://mmqb.si.com/2014/12/05/nfl-fran- ... n-iii-rg3/) limited him to throwing the ball about 10 yards in practice, and about 40 yards on game day, mostly due to adrenaline. If Chuck Foreman, Ed Marinaro and Rickey Young hadn't come along to catch all those dumpoff passes, I don't know what he would have done.

The film I've seen on Tarkenton late in his career showed him to often overthrow on long passes (the 1975 Playoff against Dallas in particular), and I wonder if he kind of over-adrenalized when he saw Gilliam running open, and overthrew him, not having been able to actually practice the timing of any long passes during the week. Also I wonder if with an overthrown long pass he wanted to send a message of sorts to the defense that his arm wasn't dead, just so they would have to defend the deep pass and not just crowd the intermediate zones.

I recall some people grumbling that Tarkenton's bread-and-butter was that he would throw a short pass to Foreman or one of the receivers, and they would break off a long run, with Tarkenton getting the passing yardage.

[Hail Casares]

Surprised no mention of Drew Brees here.