Professional Football Researchers Association Forum

I get the feeling that you are a little bitter because those late '90's Bronco teams are kind of forgotten about because they fell in between that NFC run of dominance and the Patriots dynasty.

I am not upset, because it's just a game, but I will put it to you this way:

Who did the 97 Broncos beat in the SB, and who did those NFC teams (from 84-96 beat) in the Super Bowl?

Well, the Broncos beat the best defense in the NFL and the three-time MVP in Brett Favre. Their offensive line neutralized a behemoth in Gilbert Brown, and Tony Jones did a great job against Reggie White (and, they did a great job on Leroy Butler as well).

Who did these NFC teams beat in the SB? Usually nobody special. There were only two times in that 13-year span that the AFC team was favored: Super Bowl XXII (Den-Was) and SB XXV (Buf-NYG).

Miami and Denver were one-man bands. And, when the 49ers played the Broncos, John Elway was sick as a dog with a bad cough, and Wade Phillips was running the wrong defensive scheme (a static 3-4 with the safeties wide).

As for the Bills, they should have won the first one, but those teams weren't as great as people think. They got there the last three years (1991-93) because the AFC was so inept. Chris Mortensen said in The Sporting News after the first Dallas loss that the Bills should have traded either Jim Kelly or Thurman Thomas. I would have traded Thermal, and he wouldn't have been the only guy I got rid of.

Then, after the 49ers defeated one of the worst teams to make the SB in the 94 Chargers, the Cowboys may have won the next year because Neil O'Donnell threw the game (it looked like the fix was in on those two INT's).

And, in 96, the Packers beat the third-best team in the AFC.

Overall, that NFC run wasn't as impressive as it seemed at the time.

I realize that I'm opening myself to a lot of potential criticism here but this discussion - IMHO - seems to be totally off the rails.

The Bills and Broncos dominated the AFC Championship Games for their time. Denver won 3 out of 4 and the Bills won 4 straight. I don't care what they did two weeks later. They went through multiple seasons of everybody preparing their best game for them each and every week. And they still won and won. Despite every team knowing what they were going to do.

I followed the Broncos very closely during that time. What I remember about Denver's defense is that they did what Bill Walsh called one of the most important things championship teams do - they had a late-game pass rush that was as good as any I can remember. Close games, late in the 4th quarter, yeah Elway was unparalleled. But that front 7 created a lot of havoc late in games after momentum started to swing. Rulon Jones made big plays. So did Karl Mecklenburg, who got the ball back to Denver with a third down stop in OT in the Drive game. Denver, again IMO, their secondary was lacking in their losses. Simms had a record-setting day. Then, there was no way to keep up with Monk, Clark, and Sanders, and then Rice, Taylor, Craig/Rathman, Brent Jones.

Not sure how a 15-1 team can be overrated, especially considering they outscored opponents 82-26 in the playoffs. Each win by at least three touchdowns. They had a shutout in the NFC Championship.

Winning percentages of opponents. Sigh. Okay, so you've got 3 teams that are 0-2 from playing SF. The rest are 0-1 except for the Steelers who beat them by 3 points. So, you see how the winning percentages of the other teams automatically goes down? It's a 16-game season - 14 in Miami's case. One game is weighted much higher in football than other sports with a lot of games. It's kind of like when people forget to count themselves when counting the number of people in a room. You need to factor in that a lower winning percentage is partially because SF beat them.

7DnBrnc53 wrote: ↑Sat May 18, 2024 2:55 am

I get the feeling that you are a little bitter because those late '90's Bronco teams are kind of forgotten about because they fell in between that NFC run of dominance and the Patriots dynasty.

I am not upset, because it's just a game, but I will put it to you this way:

Who did the 97 Broncos beat in the SB, and who did those NFC teams (from 84-96 beat) in the Super Bowl?

Well, the Broncos beat the best defense in the NFL and the three-time MVP in Brett Favre. Their offensive line neutralized a behemoth in Gilbert Brown, and Tony Jones did a great job against Reggie White (and, they did a great job on Leroy Butler as well).

Who did these NFC teams beat in the SB? Usually nobody special. There were only two times in that 13-year span that the AFC team was favored: Super Bowl XXII (Den-Was) and SB XXV (Buf-NYG).

Miami and Denver were one-man bands. And, when the 49ers played the Broncos, John Elway was sick as a dog with a bad cough, and Wade Phillips was running the wrong defensive scheme (a static 3-4 with the safeties wide).

As for the Bills, they should have won the first one, but those teams weren't as great as people think. They got there the last three years (1991-93) because the AFC was so inept. Chris Mortensen said in The Sporting News after the first Dallas loss that the Bills should have traded either Jim Kelly or Thurman Thomas. I would have traded Thermal, and he wouldn't have been the only guy I got rid of.

Then, after the 49ers defeated one of the worst teams to make the SB in the 94 Chargers, the Cowboys may have won the next year because Neil O'Donnell threw the game (it looked like the fix was in on those two INT's).

And, in 96, the Packers beat the third-best team in the AFC.

Overall, that NFC run wasn't as impressive as it seemed at the time.

Dallas' 2 SB teams weren't THAT great either. Emmitt was propped by the O-Line, Aikman was the most overrated QB in the history of sports, Irvin had average stats for a so-called playmaker, and their defense was OK at best.

They only one because they feasted on an overrated NFCE (Aging Giants, aging Redskins, fraudulent Eagles, terrible Cardinals)

Toughest division in sports..... beating up on Phoenix basically inflated their win records.

Dallas was a finesse team with an overrated HC that got by on pure talent and absolute luck.

Jimmy Johnson was a TERRIBLE sideline coach who basically only became a ;legend' because of the stupidity of Mike Lynn. Period.

CSKreager wrote: ↑Sun May 19, 2024 12:02 am

7DnBrnc53 wrote: ↑Sat May 18, 2024 2:55 am

I get the feeling that you are a little bitter because those late '90's Bronco teams are kind of forgotten about because they fell in between that NFC run of dominance and the Patriots dynasty.

I am not upset, because it's just a game, but I will put it to you this way:

Who did the 97 Broncos beat in the SB, and who did those NFC teams (from 84-96 beat) in the Super Bowl?

Well, the Broncos beat the best defense in the NFL and the three-time MVP in Brett Favre. Their offensive line neutralized a behemoth in Gilbert Brown, and Tony Jones did a great job against Reggie White (and, they did a great job on Leroy Butler as well).

Who did these NFC teams beat in the SB? Usually nobody special. There were only two times in that 13-year span that the AFC team was favored: Super Bowl XXII (Den-Was) and SB XXV (Buf-NYG).

Miami and Denver were one-man bands. And, when the 49ers played the Broncos, John Elway was sick as a dog with a bad cough, and Wade Phillips was running the wrong defensive scheme (a static 3-4 with the safeties wide).

As for the Bills, they should have won the first one, but those teams weren't as great as people think. They got there the last three years (1991-93) because the AFC was so inept. Chris Mortensen said in The Sporting News after the first Dallas loss that the Bills should have traded either Jim Kelly or Thurman Thomas. I would have traded Thermal, and he wouldn't have been the only guy I got rid of.

Then, after the 49ers defeated one of the worst teams to make the SB in the 94 Chargers, the Cowboys may have won the next year because Neil O'Donnell threw the game (it looked like the fix was in on those two INT's).

And, in 96, the Packers beat the third-best team in the AFC.

Overall, that NFC run wasn't as impressive as it seemed at the time.

Dallas' 2 SB teams weren't THAT great either. Emmitt was propped by the O-Line, Aikman was the most overrated QB in the history of sports, Irvin had average stats for a so-called playmaker, and their defense was OK at best.

They only one because they feasted on an overrated NFCE (Aging Giants, aging Redskins, fraudulent Eagles, terrible Cardinals)

Toughest division in sports..... beating up on Phoenix basically inflated their win records.

Dallas was a finesse team with an overrated HC that got by on pure talent and absolute luck.

Jimmy Johnson was a TERRIBLE sideline coach who basically only became a ;legend' because of the stupidity of Mike Lynn. Period.

Lol are you sure you and Bronco fan aren't the same person posting on multiple different accounts? Maybe you should also start saying how a quarterback being sick as an excuse as to why his team lost 55-10 in a Super Bowl.

The NFC East of that era was probably the most dominant division since the league went to the divisional set up. From '86 to '95 that division won 7 Super Bowls by three separate teams. The majority of those seasons they got multiple teams in the playoffs and also saw several years wear three of the five teams saw double digit win totals. Maybe the only other division you may try to compare to it was the AFC Central of the '70's. Even then though no other team in the Central got to the Super Bowl. It was just the Steelers, Raiders, and Dolphins (from three entirely separate divisions) throughout the entire decade. It was the Raiders and not anyone else from the Central that took over once the Steelers fell off a bit.

When you have that many teams within your own division winning the Super Bowl it isn't any surprise why that division became so good as they had to compete against Super Bowl champions just to win their own division. And the Eagles weren't no slouch either as they went to the playoffs several times during that span as well.

Jimmy Johnson had a great eye for talent as he assembled the majority of the young talent on that team and he was a great motivator of young players. The one knock you can probably put on him is that he never stuck around long at any one place he was at and didn't seem to have the same kind of motivational capabilities at Miami where he wasn't coaching young talent (I imagine he knew he was better at coaching young players than more veteran teams which is why he never stayed a lengthy time at any one place).

Dallas' 2 SB teams weren't THAT great either. Emmitt was propped by the O-Line, Aikman was the most overrated QB in the history of sports, Irvin had average stats for a so-called playmaker, and their defense was OK at best.

They only one because they feasted on an overrated NFCE (Aging Giants, aging Redskins, fraudulent Eagles, terrible Cardinals)

Toughest division in sports..... beating up on Phoenix basically inflated their win records.

Dallas was a finesse team with an overrated HC that got by on pure talent and absolute luck.

Jimmy Johnson was a TERRIBLE sideline coach who basically only became a ;legend' because of the stupidity of Mike Lynn. Period.

Now, I think that Brady and Montana are more overrated, but overall I agree.

And, Chris's account is not another one of my accounts. I only have one account on here (7DnBrnc53).

CSKreager wrote: ↑Sun May 19, 2024 12:02 am Dallas' 2 SB teams weren't THAT great either. Emmitt was propped by the O-Line, Aikman was the most overrated QB in the history of sports, Irvin had average stats for a so-called playmaker, and their defense was OK at best.

They only one because they feasted on an overrated NFCE (Aging Giants, aging Redskins, fraudulent Eagles, terrible Cardinals)

Toughest division in sports..... beating up on Phoenix basically inflated their win records.

Dallas was a finesse team with an overrated HC that got by on pure talent and absolute luck.

Jimmy Johnson was a TERRIBLE sideline coach who basically only became a ;legend' because of the stupidity of Mike Lynn. Period.

So Smith was propped up, Aikman overrated, Playmaker average, defense ok at best. Yet you say they got by on pure talent? lol
That doesn't make sense. Awesome rant though

JWL wrote: ↑Thu May 16, 2024 8:58 pm Jeez. Every team sucked in the 1980s.

7DnBrnc53 wrote: ↑Sat May 18, 2024 2:55 am Chris Mortensen said in The Sporting News after the first Dallas loss that the Bills should have traded either Jim Kelly or Thurman Thomas. I would have traded Thermal, and he wouldn't have been the only guy I got rid of.

Ah yes, the start of 'hot take' reporting with guys dropping in to ESPN to deliver some soundbites. What would trading Kelly or Thomas have accomplished? What precedent was Mortenson citing?

Can you imagine if that actually happened? Would it be regarded as the most asinine trade in NFL history?

Bryan wrote: ↑Mon May 20, 2024 9:19 am

7DnBrnc53 wrote: ↑Sat May 18, 2024 2:55 am Chris Mortensen said in The Sporting News after the first Dallas loss that the Bills should have traded either Jim Kelly or Thurman Thomas. I would have traded Thermal, and he wouldn't have been the only guy I got rid of.

Ah yes, the start of 'hot take' reporting with guys dropping in to ESPN to deliver some soundbites. What would trading Kelly or Thomas have accomplished? What precedent was Mortenson citing?

Can you imagine if that actually happened? Would it be regarded as the most asinine trade in NFL history?

Apparently 7DnBrnc53 thinks it would have been a good idea since he doesn’t think any of the Bills players were ever good (in what world is Andre Lofton or Andre Reed overrated?)

Haha ... In what world was the Johnson-Aikman led Cowboys a "finesse" team? Yes, the defense was small and flew to the ball but that offensive line would pound a front-seven defense into the turf ... then, Moose and Emmitt would clean-up, into the end zone. Smith was powering through defenses and breaking tackles before anyone knew who played on the offensive line.

Michael Irvin was stronger than most safeties, much less cornerbacks, which is why he got away with so much offensive pass interference ... right into the HOF