Madden Passes

Brian wolf
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Re: Madden Passes

Post by Brian wolf »

Its still incredible that Al Davis, who was given a small piece of ownership stake in the Raiders starting in 1967 I believe, would hire a young linebacker coach to run his ballclub after the unexpected resignation of John Rauch, following the AFL Championship loss in 1968. Rauch had helped Davis forge his vertical offensive philosophy for the team as an assistant then head coach but wanted more autonomy, that he didnt feel Davis gave, so he left with everyone in shock.

Davis knew that John Madden was an enthusiastic student of the game and communicator but wisely felt that he could incorporate his own coaching, influence into the team and Madden admitted in his first book that he had no problem with it as long as the final decisions were his. Obviously it was true as the Raiders went from a more wide-open pass attack from Lamonica to a ball control running game with Stabler, though many writers and football broadcasters still thought Davis made all the decisions, even during gamedays. They obviously worked well together, though it took forever for the team to win its first championship. I feel the Raiders had such an easy time within their own division, with the Chiefs aging so rapidly, that by playoff time against teams as good as their own, they would have letdowns or be overconfident ...
RRMarshall
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Re: Madden Passes

Post by RRMarshall »

Madden leads all NFL coaches in All-Time winning percentage, but taking away his persona as a TV personality and announcer where does he stand among the elite coaches of all-time? I like to make the comparison to Earl Weaver of the Orioles in baseball who had phenomenal success fielding winning teams with multiple postseason appearances year after year but yet in the final analysis they both can claim only one world championship. Does that detract from his/their legacy??
Brian wolf
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Re: Madden Passes

Post by Brian wolf »

I feel if Madden can get elected to the HOF with one championship, Buck Shaw should get in as well. They both coached in different leagues, had many wins and coached many great, HOF players. Shaw was successful with two different teams, though he lost an AAFC Champ game.
rhickok1109
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Re: Madden Passes

Post by rhickok1109 »

I never thought he was a very good broadcaster. His "insight" seemed to consist mostly of saying "Boom!" now and then.
I specifically remember two really mindless things he came up with.
The first was in a Packer game when the Packers faced something like 3rd-and-32 after a holding penalty and two sacks. Madden, who constantly criticized the WCO, said snidely, "The West Coast Offense doesn't have any 32-yard pass plays." I remarked to a friend, "What a stupid comment." And Favre immediately completed a pass about 40 yards downfield to Antonio Freeman, who turned it into a gain of 60-plus yards.
The second was his famous comment in SB XXXVI, when he said the Patriots should just let the clock run out and let the game go to overtime. Again, I said that was stupid because the Rams had scored 2 unanswered TDs in the 4th quarter to tie the game and if they won the toss they were very likely to score again and win without the Patriots even getting the ball. Sure enough, Belichick agreed with me, not Madden, and you know the rest of the story.
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Bryan
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Re: Madden Passes

Post by Bryan »

...and LC Greenwood knocks it down!

Madden's teams were always good. He was very pragmatic in his approach and was able to maintain consistent success despite transitioning between players and schemes. Yes, he only won 1 championship, but his teams were markedly better than Buck Shaw's teams (and George Allen's teams and Hank Stram's teams). His Raider teams were rarely outmatched; they were always competitive in their losses. I can only think of a couple times when Madden's Raiders were easily defeated (73 AFC Championship, 76 reg season NE).
Brian wolf
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Re: Madden Passes

Post by Brian wolf »

Madden's broadcasting career was kind of crazy. He started out very mild-mannered but informative and quickly was thrust into being part of the number one broadcasting team with Pat Summerall, after being tried with other announcers.

Terry O Neil, the new producer for CBS, who loved John's work ethic, ability to explain football terminology in laymans terms and humor, chose him over other good announcers, like George Allen and Hank Stram to start teaming with Summerall because he wanted to split up the on-air drinking partnership with Tom Brookshier and felt it would motivate Pat to produce his best work, not that Summerall was ever off his game. Vin Scully, who believed he should be the lead announcer for the network approaching the 1981/82 Super Bowl, basically left CBS after Summerall/Madden were chosen. Madden's best work and color innovations like the telestrator, chalkboard etc were during the 81-86 era but his popularity also made him start to become more long-winded and bombastic, which depended upon the always professional Summerall to keep deferring to him, allowing him to stammer and repeat himself, while Pat could come up with a great quip or lid on his points.

With the NFC becoming the dominant conference, viewers had to admire John's connections with teams and players, as he was also a champion for showing and highlighting players in the pits on both sides of the lines, giving huge players, spotlights they never had. His talking and analysis though could be annoying to non-fans though. By the mid nineties, his on-air comments could cause a stir with fans of teams who had won or lost, who felt he didnt have the right to question or "first-guess" on-field coaching decisions. By then, CBS lost the NFC rights to the Fox network, where Madden championed for the crew and staffs to start fresh there, where John got even more free reign but it established the Network, who really only had Married With Children at the time.

Madden finally changed once he got his dream job with MNF and SNF, where he calmed down more and wasnt as repetitive or loud and seemed to be rejuvenated with another veteran like Al Michaels. Once he made the HOF, he was active alot on the new NFL Network as well, which I loved in the beginning but can barely watch now ...
RichardBak
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Re: Madden Passes

Post by RichardBak »

John Madden was a true original, something that we see less and less of in a world filled with focus groups, manufactured wannabes, and pale imitations. He was a superb analyst, dumbing down (for dummies like me) plays, strategies, formations, etc. and always maintaining--Boom!--a genuine enthusiasm for the game. I would have loved to have spent an afternoon talking football and just life in general with this guy.

As I'm reminded every time I flip on the tube, everybody says mindless shit every now and then. No analyst is right 100% of the time. You don't win a record 16 Emmy awards for adding nothing to the game you're broadcasting.

Personally, I really have to admire how a guy like Madden, who came basically from nowhere and nothing, made himself into a success and an icon. How many people have a Super Bowl ring, a place in the HOF, have written NYT best-sellers, won 16 Emmys, made hundreds of millions of dollars, is the namesake of a wildly popular video game, and has a name instantaneously synonymous with football? And off the field he seemed to be a regular kind of guy---married to the same woman for 60+ years, raised two sons who aren't drags on society. The family stuff alone is hard to get right for most guys in the spotlight.

Well done, John. Well done.
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GameBeforeTheMoney
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Re: Madden Passes

Post by GameBeforeTheMoney »

Hard not to absolutely love John Madden. He was great at explaining the game and pointing out offensive linemen and other players who often get overlooked, guys like Tom Rathman. Taught a lot of us to appreciate a lot of nuances that we might have missed and the CBS Chalkboard was the greatest thing when it came out. Sure, he might have become a parody of himself late in his broadcasting career, circling the Gatorade bucket and mud on shoes, but when he first started he was just incredible at explaining the game in easy-to-understand ways and was very entertaining at the same time. He broke things down and taught you why they were important and how certain plays and players affected the outcomes of games. The All-Madden Team was a must-watch show and he got excited like a fan because, at the end of the day, he was a fan of the game. It felt like he likely would have said the same things if he were sitting on the couch next to you, except he was on national tv and that's one of the things that set him apart -- he was so genuine and a lot more relaxed on air. I loved George Allen and Tom Brookshier and Bob Trumpy and Merlin and most of the other commentators of the day like everyone else, but Madden had this ability to seem more like one of your buddies rather than a football coach or former player talking about the game. He was very relatable in a way that I don't know if anyone else has ever been able to do.

As a coach, he got the Raiders to the AFC Championship Game several years in a row. I can't remember the number off the top of my head but it must have been at least 5. Won a Super Bowl. He had some excellent players but it wasn't like he had collected a lot of superstars as maybe some other teams. I guess what I'm saying is that he got a lot out of his players and they played together very well as a team.
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Brian wolf
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Re: Madden Passes

Post by Brian wolf »

The All-Madden team specials were fun to watch every year before the SB and John liked to tease viewers with who was going to make it mostly based on postseason success. Many players were honored to be on the teams and some insisted on using the selections during contract negotiations ... now thats influence ! .

Players who visited John during the week also wanted him to make sure their fundamentals and habits were proper. Even Bill Parcells tried to hire him as a coach during training camp.
racepug
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Re: Madden Passes

Post by racepug »

When I think of the Raiders, John Madden is still the head coach who comes to mind. To me, nobody else in that franchise's history comes close.
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